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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Oct 25, 2009 20:21:45 GMT
One of the most underrated superstars in the league...there is nothing he cant do...scoring, passing (6 assists per game!), shooting, playing D, running, dribbling, clutch plays + he has a great durability and conditioning...a true franchise player
only 85? Pierce and Carter are 89...JJ needs to be at least 89
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Post by jlawdrummer - GSW on Oct 25, 2009 22:56:00 GMT
I gotta agree that he needs to come up from an 85, and should be around an 89.
Also, Carter should come down a point or two if he's not already scheduled to do so.
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Post by Boston Celtics on Oct 26, 2009 11:34:40 GMT
I actually would put JJ a notch lower than Pierce and Carter. But he could be higher than an 85, maybe an 86 or 87.
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Post by jlawdrummer - GSW on Oct 26, 2009 21:11:07 GMT
I actually would put JJ a notch lower than Pierce and Carter. Then I think you're underrating Joe Johnson in that comparison.
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Post by Miami Heat on Oct 26, 2009 21:16:27 GMT
In my opinion it's: 1. Paul Pierce 2. Joe Johnson 3. Vince Carter
But all 3 are very close, something like 1 point separating them(e.g. 89, 87 and 86).
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Post by Denver Nuggets on Oct 27, 2009 1:06:22 GMT
I have to agree with BOS here. JJ hasn't done much. Yes he does almost everything but he's not actually very good in something. I'd say 86 perhaps. 89 is Melo's level;)
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Oct 27, 2009 2:01:55 GMT
I actually would put JJ a notch lower than Pierce and Carter. Then I think you're underrating Joe Johnson in that comparison. Joe Johnson is always underrated..it also depends a lot on hype and commercials...JJ is just "normal"...but he made the Hawks w/o great center into a great team! last year a great series against BOS...this year round two, where sadly he was injured... JJ can do it all - every single aspect of the game - T-mac had a 93 rating...Pierce and Carter have 89...as said...at least 89...
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Post by Miami Heat on Oct 27, 2009 8:48:31 GMT
Then I think you're underrating Joe Johnson in that comparison. but he made the Hawks w/o great center into a great team! I know that Al Horford's real position is power forward, but HELLO?! He's better than the most of the league's starting centres, bound to be an all-star.
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Post by New Jersey Nets on Oct 27, 2009 15:36:46 GMT
I think Johnson is fine where he is
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Oct 27, 2009 17:32:55 GMT
I think Johnson is fine where he is your reason? he's able to do it all...85 is why too low for a franchise caliber player like him!
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Post by Boston Celtics on Oct 27, 2009 19:25:00 GMT
you're putting him on-par with Carmelo though. He's not that great. He's like Al Jefferson or Andre Iguodala, although maybe a little more important than those two. He's a very good (but not great) player on an average team.
If Kobe was playing for the Hawks they'd be challenging the Celtics, Magic and Cavs. And you know I'm not a Kobe fan (although the footwork he's learned from Hakeem is amazing to watch, lol).
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Post by New Jersey Nets on Oct 27, 2009 19:49:35 GMT
I think Johnson is fine where he is your reason? he's able to do it all...85 is why too low for a franchise caliber player like him! I don't think Joe Johnson is a franchise calibur player. He has tremendous pieces around him and still barely makes the playoffs each year. He is basically Jamal Crawford but not as greedy.
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Post by greatwall - PHI on Oct 27, 2009 20:48:28 GMT
I think JJ at most is an 87, but I disagree Kobe on the Hawks would challenge.
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Oct 27, 2009 23:40:20 GMT
your reason? he's able to do it all...85 is why too low for a franchise caliber player like him! I don't think Joe Johnson is a franchise calibur player. He has tremendous pieces around him and still barely makes the playoffs each year. He is basically Jamal Crawford but not as greedy. JJ = jamal crawford are u serious? LOL i wont even comment that... Melo might be the better scorer, but overall ratings result cuz of all single ratings...JJ is the better defender, the better shooter (2pt, 3 pt and FT), the better passer, the better dribbler and even plays much more minutes than Melo! Melo is just the better scorer and rebounder....and of course he is younger... in the end its about single ratings (thats way allrounders like marion, Kirilenko and Artest have high ratings! and one-dimensional players like jamal crawford and al harrington have lower ratings)
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Post by San Antonio Spurs on Oct 28, 2009 1:51:40 GMT
JJ is not a franchise calibre player, he's more of a Robin than a Batman.
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Post by New Jersey Nets on Oct 28, 2009 3:11:50 GMT
Joe Johnson:
21.4 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 5.8 apg, 1.1 spg, .437 fg%
Jamal Crawford:
19.7 ppg, 3.3 rpg, 4.4 apg, .9 spg, .406 fg%
Johnson = Crawford on steriods
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Oct 28, 2009 10:45:11 GMT
Joe Johnson: 21.4 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 5.8 apg, 1.1 spg, .437 fg% Jamal Crawford: 19.7 ppg, 3.3 rpg, 4.4 apg, .9 spg, .406 fg% Johnson = Crawford on steriods lol crawford played for GSW (do they know defense???) even morrow and azubuike had high scoring stats do we now make stats comparisons? Joe Johnson (rated a low 85) 21.4 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 5.8 apg, 1.1 spg, .437 fg% Carter (rated 89) 20,80 ppg 5,1 rpg, 4,7 apg, 1,0 spg, ,437 fg% Ginobili (rated 87) 15,50 ppg 4,5 rpg, 3,6 apg, 1,5 spg, ,454 fg% Ray Allen (rated 88)18,2 ppg 3,5rpg, 2,8apg, 0,9spg, 0,480 fg%
besides that Johnson is the best defender with Ginobili of the mentioned above....that just shows he deserves a big rating upgrade
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Post by Miami Heat on Oct 28, 2009 10:56:23 GMT
Pierce, Ginobili, Allen all play with other 2 All-Stars together(actually Allen and Pierce might be with 3 All-Stars soon), which will decrease their stats.
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Oct 28, 2009 12:08:50 GMT
Pierce, Ginobili, Allen all play with other 2 All-Stars together(actually Allen and Pierce might be with 3 All-Stars soon), which will decrease their stats. which can also mean u get more open shots... and Iguadala plays in a weak team and "only" makes 18 points a game...and carter only makes 20... give Joe Johnson to GSW and he'll give u 25+ ...give him to BOS and JJ still will give you a 20 anyway waiting for the final decision... miami said 87, gsw 89, njn 85, BOS 86 - 87, me 89...
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Post by Miami Heat on Oct 28, 2009 12:35:52 GMT
Pierce, Ginobili, Allen all play with other 2 All-Stars together(actually Allen and Pierce might be with 3 All-Stars soon), which will decrease their stats. which can also mean u get more open shots... and Iguadala plays in a weak team and "only" makes 18 points a game...and carter only makes 20... give Joe Johnson to GSW and he'll give u 25+ ...give him to BOS and JJ still will give you a 20 anyway waiting for the final decision... miami said 87, gsw 89, njn 85, BOS 86 - 87, me 89... But at the same time it means you'll get the ball less time(because, you know, there's only one ball and there are other great players that want the ball). If he would be added to the current Celtics, I doubt that he would get 20 points per game, 15 seems more reasonable. Carter is probably rating wise good comparison, Carter is a better athletically, but JJ is better all-around player(not by much tho') and as Carter is slightly overrated right now(this comes from the owner of the Carter), 86-87 would be fine for both of them.
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Nov 5, 2009 22:52:18 GMT
final decision???
miami said 87, gsw 89, njn 85, BOS 86 - 87, me 89...
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Nov 19, 2009 1:25:07 GMT
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Post by Atlanta Hawks on Jan 19, 2010 7:13:56 GMT
one of the the top 10 MVP candidates this year again...whats the final decision?
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Post by gotice - SAC on Feb 21, 2010 17:33:48 GMT
ima stick my opinion in here I say base his rating on other SGs because JJ is the second best SG in the game. Carter should not be in the same ballpark of JJ. Passing, shooting and defense are what JJ thrives on which may be why he is so underrated.
Hope I could contribute something.
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Post by Washington Wizards on Feb 22, 2010 20:57:04 GMT
I have to agree mostly with Atlanta here. If I were ranking VC, JJ and Pierce, it would clearly be 1 -Joe Johnson, 2- Pierce and 3 - Vince...without question for me.
I also think the Ginobli and Ray Allen comparisons are valid...Johnson should certainly be rated higher than either of these guys for sure.
And lastly, I know the given stats about Crawford seem like he would be close to Johnson but in all reality, Crawford isn't in the same league as Johnson.
Whether he is Batman or Robin could be argued but he is definitely closer to the guy with the dark suit than the boy with the green tights:)
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